tv Hardball With Chris Matthews MSNBC June 7, 2011 7:00pm-8:00pm EDT
place. just when you thought the koch brothers couldn't get anymore evil they find a way of surprising you again. congratulations. all right. thank you for watching. you can always, of course, follow me online theyoungturks.com or on youtube at the young turks, of course. all right, "hardball" is up next. what happens in vegas doesn't stay in vegas any more. let's play "hardball." >> good evening. i'm chris matthews up in new york. don't look now, it just got worse for weiner. drip, drip, drip of revelations. what toppled anthony weiner. this afternoon a tabloid website published racy and explicit facebook exchanges between weiner and a las vegas blackjack
dealer. even before that, democrats were backing away from weiner and it is not at all clear he can survive this storm or that the democrats can continue to separate themselves from it. plus, weiner patiently answered countless questions at that amazing news conference yesterday afternoon, but many of his answers may have gotten him into more trouble. let's go to the videotape tonight. also, i said it yesterday. if she doesn't run, sarah palin doesn't run she will be the republican kingmaker. it is her mission to stop romney and i think bachmann as well. but with whom? with anybody? here is one from i told you so. with bush consistently against all evidence that would increase revenue and balance the budget,
ten years ago today they were signed into law, those tax cuts. let's see how wrong the people pushing them were. finally, get me a rewrite. it wasn't enough for sarah palin to rewrite paul revere. now they are trying to rewrite wikipedia to fit her view of the universe into actual history. check outside where i think she belongs. we start with weiner's political future, such as it is. i want you to read right now something on radar online. releasing e-mail between a las vegas woman, blackjack dealer and congressman weiner. now this is the conversation. you get the drift of this. let me go to alex. this kind of conversation being carried on by a 45-year-old married man in september, by the way, to continue this point of
view, the second woman, here it is. this is an e-mail, let's see, this is in september of last fall. i guess we get enough of this. let's go on. alex, maybe this is age group stuff. i guess i don't get sexting or texting or why people communicate this this little girl, little boy language. like ouch. apparently he said to someone the other day, ugh. speaks in almost a comic book, like this cartoon language in the midst of sexual conversation. >> i think that is part of protocol on social network communication and shorthand. it is intimate and so forth. but you know, i think the real issue here is this is an elected representative who has positioned himself as a champion
for liberal causes and has conducted himself in manner that won him a lot of accolades in certain corners. at the same time, he has been very strident and has been very purposeful. and in the background of this is carrying on, in his office, having phone sex conversations. having facebook conversations, twitter conversations. you have a double life. and he seems to have been living one. . show you another one far for troubling for the congressman from brooklyn just last week. that las vegas woman, the blackjack dealer, wrote him on e-mail again here, twitter i guess.
here is somebody who has heard about another kind of communication, gross kind of communication. i don't know what this stuff is about. but it looks like he said the other day in that press conference that went on forever, and we will talk about the things he opened up there, a half dozen. maybe that's a minimum notion of the number. but he carries on these relationships. he is married man, as we pointed out. i don't know what to say. here he is talking about -- what is this stuff? i'm a political guy. i don't know what to do in this territory. >> look, chris, there are so many levels to this. there is the betrayal, and i think there's the lying to his fellow members in caucus. the lying and the deceit is really unpalatable. here is someone saying he hasn't done anything wrong. it turns out he has done everything wrong.
we are getting dribs and drabs of this information. he may have tried to enlist his pr people to write up a whitewash press release, on behalf of these women saying she didn't have anything to do with this. >> dana, why don't you jump in here. on june 2nd, he e-mailed ginger lee, do you need to talk to professional pr type person to give you advice? what is the significance of all this -- this stuff? >> well, look, chris, we had last night -- anthony weiner threw down the gauntlet and said i'm going to survive this by having that press conference, apologizing 50 times. he was gambling he could get through this stuff. now, had he resigned yesterday, you probably wouldn't be reading these things, although i love it when you talk dirty, so i'm glad you are. >> well, i'm reading it. give me a break here, buddy. milbank, you're on my list of
most respected people. let's keep it that way. >> glad to be there, chris. these things will continue to come out. if this thing on radar is true, i mean, you read some very tame excerpts about that. it takes a great deal to get me to blush and that is some really gruesome stuff in there. >> in all fairness, we sat with our producers this afternoon when all this came in and decided what i could say, given who i am and what i have to be on television and i don't want to read some of this stuff. i guess it's sex talk. i don't know what else. phone sex but done on e-mail or twitter. what do you call it? here is the texas woman who received weiner's shirt and her interactions with the congressman. let's listen. >> how much of it was sex talk? >> i mean he would attempt all the time. didn't understand why he wanted to talk to me so much.
even if our exchanges, i did say why are you so open? things of that nature. it wasn't like i was chasing him at all. it was amazing, i was saying, i paraphrase what happens, what happens in vegas doesn't stay in vegas. starts out with a blackjack dealer. then a texas woman. then the woman who started all this. the person out in seattle. this is going to be one of those, there is a local angle for everyone local affiliate will have a piece of this action. this is permeating and getting around to people in congress who now have to explain it and defend it in their own districts. i'm thinking, is any democrat safe under this? 15 democrats, a list of republican campaign just put out, people who got several thousand dollars apiece from weiner and they are demanding they get it back.
it is metastasizing. so many democrats. when are they going to call me to the caucus and say, this has to end. >> right. there is the ethical consideration of what he did with his congressional resources, legal consideration. but i think that's all secondary here for the political considerations. first of all, he lied to his colleagues. i was at a breakfast with steve israel last week, and he said, hey, look, the guy was hacked. he's done just the right thing. now, he has it come out with this forceful statement saying it should be sent to the ethics committee. the fact of the matter, he has really embarrassed his colleagues here. even a little business bit of this sort of sex talk, the judgment of this man is completely unacceptable. it has nothing do with ideology, who could sit next to him in the caucus room. >> the republicans have been very good over the years of finding someone from one of the
coasts, whether tip o'neill or ted kennedy or pelosi or barney frank or you know, bella abzug. usually an ethnic person from the coast is a good target, a liberal. then pound them in everywhere in the country. looks like it will be weiner. >> you see how the national senate campaign. >> the nrcc. >> nrcc they are attacking 16 democrats say they are willing to return funds they received from weiner in the 2010 election. >> of course they will forgive him when he gives the money back. he was forced to give money back to weiner. right, dana? you admit doing something wrong when you give the money back. i want you to comment, too. this is in the rules of the house. one of the overreaching statements that captures what you said under a codified way. in the first sentence of the house ethics manual, which you get as a new member of congress,
it says, "members, officers and employees should conduct themselves in a manner that reflects credibly on the house." this is the kind of language i believe going back it even mccarthy for a different reason, they got him censored. you can't believe in a way that embarrasses the institution. is this what weiner really is facing here, dana? >> well arguably, 435 members could be guilty of that at some point or another. but this is so beyond the pale here. that certainly he would be up against that. i suspect, look, the ethics investigations go on forever. >> you're not talking about going into a committee. do you really think that pelosi really expects a six or seven nonpartisan people to sit in a room and go in a room and go over details for months. >> no. that's why it is secondary to the political consideration here, is this completely intolerable for democrats. i would be having to think these things out would be intolerable for weiner himself and he wants to just put an end to it. >> his alternative is going off into nowhere and being a former member of congress, admitting your guilt. if he sticks it out, that's his
own call. in his own personal interest, once he goes down and says i did something wrong enough to quit over, he is saying i did something wrong enough to quit over. he is self-indicting. if hangs in there, he has at least a job, a position, a staff and a role to play in american society, even if he is hated. >> you have to wonder what are the dynamics in congress. harry reid is asked today about weiner and says ask someone else. >> how much clout does weiner have in brooklyn? i mean, how much does harry reid have in brooklyn? none. if people of your district -- people stand behind you -- i'll go back to you, dana, and people stand behind you despite the crud thrown at you and you throw at yourself here, why not stick it out and say in the long run -- bl clinton stuck it out. he did okay. vitter, somewhat similar situation in louisiana, he is a senator for life. >> it's possible.
weiner -- this is a placeholder position for him. he made no secret he wants to run for mayor in 2013. you have to think that is now a pipe dream as well. so, his audience is the people of new york there. are they going to be that flexible? i mean, i'm a new yorker, but i don't think -- i don't think they will tolerate that much. so his whole being in the house was a way to get into gracie mansion. >> you say he stays or leaves dana? >> i think he leaves. >> coming up, weiner answering dozens of questions yesterday. we thought maybe too many, led to too many more questions. now he may have opened up more trouble for himself as we are seeing with this latest dispatch from vegas. you're watching "hardball," only on msnbc. introducing precise pain relieving cream. it blocks pain signals fast for relief precisely where you need it most. precise.
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here is where he ran into trouble. let's listen. >> i have exchanged messages and photos of a explicit nature with about six women over the last three years. listen, i'm going to try to tell you everything that i can remember. my blackberry is not a government blackberry. my home computer is usually where i did these things. >> usually? >> i don't have the knowledge of every last communication, but i don't believe i used any government resources. >> let ask you about that. when i listen to someone on the tv this morning, very early this morning, where someone said, congressmen, to be blunt, can call up their girlfriends or mistresses.
>> i don't know the exact ages of the women. and i don't know if you do, i'm going to respect their privacy, but they were all adults, at least to the best of my knowledge. >> wow. michael isikoff is on the show, nbc news investigative correspondent, beth in the business. and former independent counsel also served as chief counsel of the senate rules committee. gentlemen, thank you for joining us. let's go over these stories that seem to be shall as we say in journalism, created lechs for this story. first of all this whole question of multiple women discussed now, coming out. mike isikoff is this going to be one of those stories where you just get more and more information as the days go on, you just have to keep reporting it? is that his biggest problem? >> sure, first of all. he said a half a dozen in the press conference. now, remember, there's going to be an electronic trail of all his messages. now that we have that ethics
committee investigation, the committee is going to be doubt tu-bound, let's see the elect tropic trail, twitter messages, facebook messages and hold that up against what he said in the press conference yesterday. the line that left out of the press conference is he said, "in some cases, i initiated them." now, if he is initiating these exchanges, including sending lewd photos of himself, it makes you wonder if the half-dozen figure he used was just those who reciprocated or whether there were others out there who got these lewd photos or lewd messages and didn't reciprocate at all. as i said with before, presumably there will be an electronic trail that is going to answer that question, and i think that is potentially extremely dangerous for him. >> joe, wide open question right now.
as former prosecutor, do you see this as a prosecutable case or just bad behavior, unethical? is it a criminal situation potentially? >> i don't see anything criminal yet unless some of the recipients of his pictures were under age. we don't know the answer it that an neither does he. >> neither does he. >> neither does he. i don't think it is criminal yet. but it is clearly an ethics question. that's why nancy pelosi dove for the ethics committee as quickly as she could. >> are you confident an ethics committee won't bury this? >> oh, i don't think they can now. that's literally impossible after the news conference yesterday. of course, you know the really awful photographs will be available on the internet shortly. no matter what andrew breitbart says he won't publish, he isn't the only possessor of those photographs. they'll be sold to tabloids and other people on the net. those pictures will be out. once those are out, he's done. >> you say that because breitbart says they weren't
pictures that -- he was given to them secondhand, so there for someone else has them firsthand. >> correct. they will come out because they will be bought. once the pictures are out, he cannot stay in congress. >> let's go to something i do find tangential. here is weiner when he talked about whether he was using government resources, telephone, e-mail. i don't think this is important, but let's check it out with you guys. here he is talking. >> listen, i'm going to try to tell you everything that i can remember was my blackberry is not a government blackberry. my home computer is usually where i did these things. >> usually? >> i don't have the knowledge of every last communication, but i don't believe that i used any government resources. >> mike isikoff, let ask you about that. i listen to someone on the tv this morning, very early this morning, i think it was "morning joe," where someone said,
congressmen, to be blunt, can call up their girlfriends or mistresses. there is nothing illegal. obviously a moral issue. but is there anything in the rules that says you can't use your electronic equipment for anything as long as it isn't criminal? >> you started out with the line from the house ethics manual, which is sort of this broad generic, you can't do anything that brings dishonor upon the house. and i think using -- look, if there is any government equipment here used at all, a telephone, a computer, i think that's one more nail in the many nails in his coffin at this point. >> really? it doesn't matter whether he is yelling into a dixie cup. does it really matter? >> this was sort of a textbook example of how to inflict maximum political damage on yourself. i mean, he took what was a pretty bad situation and made it so much worse by the way he handled it, starting out with sort of his arrogance last week, attacking the press. lying brazenly. and then having to come before
the press yesterday and admit almost everything he said last week was a complete lie. that doesn't give you a lot of confidence that everything he said yesterday is going to hold up against that electronic trail that's going to be available. >> i got to have dinner with you, sir. you are always rich in your perspective. for older viewers like me right now, suppose this is a british scandal where there is girls involved rather than a kinky scandal, like the famous woman from perfume. without soviet spies, supposedly just a congressman, married but with a lot of girlsfriends. no virtual use of electronic equipment. no e-mail or twitter or weird phone sex, the real kind of sex. would that be at all an ethics issue? let's be blunt. >> that's a very interesting question, chris. i think it depends on who the congressman was. one of the things at work is who
weiner was. he was the lead attack dog for democrats in the house if not in the senate. he was a nasty, arrogant, vicious attack dog. part of his problem is, is that because he was the lead dog that way, when you fall from that, you fall very hard. and look at the absence of supporters. and whether or not he had girlfriends, that probably would not have made a difference. what does make a difference are the photographs. the actual realistic photographs of body parts. it reveals, chris, a very serious psychological problem. everybody knows it. this guy has a very serious psychological problem. >> this is like avatar sex. it's the strangest thing. i'm thinking of a case like a celebrated role model like tiger woods. everybody looked up to him.
he was on the wheaties box. not now, but he was. here is a case of a guy that is like an exhibitionist. is that the problem of just putting it out there on pictures so everybody is sharing? >> but remember, it is partly that. but remember, chris, part of the problem is, you know, you hear from people about the way he treated his staff in public, how he would yell at them, the bullying. i think that's part of this. you have to look the at entire character after guy like this. this guy has a series of deep-seeded problems. and i don't think he has a lot of friends right now on the democratic side of the aisle and you need them in a crisis like this. >> are you dr. drew tonight? i guess that's common sense. i shouldn't be sarcastic. obviously, this guy shouldn't be doing what he's doing. i can contribute it to brain soup is the phrase we use. who knows what our brains are doing. thank you michael isikoff, you're the best. thank you, joe.
we've got to get together. >> it's a deal. presidential candidates saying we stormed normandy on d-day so we could have obama care. these people remind me on the show on bullwinkle, on the wayback machine, using history for the crazyest reasons. where are we going today, mr. sherman? you're watching "hardball." only on msnbc. [ woman speaking chinese ] thank you. do you have an english menu?
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>> on this day, d-day, june 6, in 1944, almost 60,000 average americans had the courage to go out and charge those beaches on normandy. those americans risked everything so they could make that decision on their healthcare plan. >> wow, world war ii is about healthcare options? that's an interesting reads. we haven't heard that one before. by the way, president roosevelt, our commander in chief in world war ii was for national healthcare. so were the british who stormed the beaches who had healthcare within a year or so. sarah palin takes on paul revere, taken for a ride on stephen colbert. >> ringing a bell and firing shots from a front-loading musket. all i have to say is prepare to eat historical reenactments. first, we insert a farthing to activate my steed.
hey. hey, british. you, you, the british are coming. here is a warning shot. okay. now, to warn the next town the british are on their way. i just have to reload. i just have to -- i certainly hope paul revere was wearing a cup. >> palin supporters are now going after the messenger, wikipedia. they are trying to change the paul revere entry in wikipedia, which brings us to the big number. as palin fans re-enter the wikipedia, others are reflecting the real history. how big is this war of words? before palin's words, paul
revere's wikipedia had 2,000 views a day. now they are 140,000. 140,000 page views, tonight's big number. up next, sarah palin is running, if not for president, then the republican kingmaker. either way she needs to stop mitt romney. she needs to stop, i believe, bachmann. she wants pawlenty or someone to beat the people she doesn't like. we have ed rollins, the brand-new campaign manager for michele bachmann up here next. you're watch "hardball," only on msnbc. if i get a snack now, pill now? skip the snack, pill later... late dinner, pill now? aghh i've got heartburn in my head. [ male announcer ] stop the madness. take prilosec otc for frequent heartburn. one pill a day. twenty-four hours. zero heartburn. no heartburn in the first place. great.
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grave there containing two dozen dismembered bodies, some children. search dogs are on scene and the fbi has forensics teams on stand by but the property owners are reportedly not cooperating with police and authorities still trying to obtain a search warrant. stay with msnbc for more upcommunities developing story. a ferocious wildfire in arizona has scorched more than 700 square miles, making it the second largest wildfire in arizona history. federal reserve chairman ben bernanke blamed a slowing recovery on high gas price and disasters in japan but predicted growth will pick up in the second half of the year. and nbc one the right to broadcast the olympics for another four years, outbidding espn and fox in a four-game deal worth about $4.5 billion. back to "hardball." now gas is $4 a gallon.
home prices are in the gutter. our healthcare system, thanks to obamacare, is more expensive and less efficient. unemployment's back over 9%. our national debt has skyrocketed. our budget deficit has grown worse. and the jobs and manufacturing reports are grim. now if that was recovery, then our president needs to enter economic rehab. and the american people need to stop his policies cold turkey. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was tim pawlenty reading something somebody wrote, but he can't read it. of course, a new "washington post"/abc news poll out today says how bad it is. 59% of the poll disapproves. he does okay on those issues but not on the economy.
the president is now statistically tied with mitt romney head to head. >> they are all serious contenders. i think it is too hard to predict who will become the nominee, who will become the two finalists. usually you have two people that end up battling it down the stretch. i don't know who they will be. i believe i will one of those two and that i will finally get the nomination. >> wow. romney is on the mark, according to an abc poll. he leads the field with 22% and palin right behind him. will palin be the next person he is waiting for or is there someone else in mind? here is whether she will run or be a kingmaker. let's listen. >> whether it is me throwing my name is the hat or supporting the right candidates, the response has been great confirmation of the need for a real positive change in this country. >> and you have always been really straight with me. after this week, and obviously, you got a lot of attention. there was a big response. does it make you lean more
towards running? >> i tell you, the response has -- i haven't interpreted it as being about me, about being me as a candidate or a potential candidate. it's been about the message, chris. >> she wasn't talking to me obviously. is that the end game to be the 2012 kingmaker? republican strategist ed rollins will be a strategist. tea party for two, a beautiful cartoon. let me go to my friend ed rollins. here is what i think you're facing, tell me if i'm wrong. sarah palin doesn't want romney. we have a lot of reasons. she is not him and he's not her. she doesn't want bachmann. she thinks bachmann is imitating her.
she wants a nominee that she can claim she made. >> well, she won't make anybody. if she wants it run, they will be the credible candidate. you have to run these things. >> she can't be the tiger in somebody's tank? >> no. we haven't played that game in a long, long time. and my sense, as romney said last night, it comes down to two, maybe three. he may be one of the ones. i would give it a 50/50 chance. >> so you are working for bachmann? >> i'm working for ms. bachmann. >> right. congresswoman bachmann. do you say on the record here, palin doesn't matter? >> well, if she runs she matters. >> well if she doesn't run? >> if she doesn't run, she doesn't matter. >> that's a statement for the record. >> she just said she will matter if she doesn't run. >> we don't have any kingmakers any more. >> no tammany hall, no boss tweed? can she play a role if she doesn't run. >> i think if you look, last week -- >> you need access, he just needs to be a candidate.
>> last week, a lot of reporters were up in new hampshire. we watched sarah palin come to new hampshire while mitt romney was trying to announce her presidential campaign. we watched her suck up all of the media oxygen. we watched her attack his health plan and end up on the front page of the "union leader" with him on page 3. with all due respect to ed, she may not be the kingmaker but by dissing candidates, she can hurt people in a variety of ways. >> fair enough. back to my sense here she doesn't want romney. she is afraid he might win and
be president for eight years. the other thing she doesn't want bachmann, who she sees as an imitator. >> on the first, i would agree with you. i don't think she is aligned with romney. she has done things to hurt him. i don't know how she feels about bachmann. she endorsed michele bachmann in the past. i don't know why she wouldn't be want to be on michele bachmann's team. as ed said, is she going to get in? right now, i'm back to thinking it is 50/50. she looked that bus tour and said, this is -- >> how can she run -- >> i think i might be able to pull this off and just say, i'm going to deny all of the old rules and do it my way. you might think that's crazy. >> can you run for major party without knowing anything? i'm not talking about intelligence. she's intelligent. most people in politics are average intelligence. it is about doing your homework and doing basics. she is challenging wikipedia. she is having a hard argument over paul revere now when every kid in america knows one if by land, two if by sea. >> as a historian, i'm sure there have been some presidents that didn't know much when they got elected, lots of candidates. i would say this, she hasn't over the last couple years done
the serious stuff that most people have done. >> why not? >> i don't know. >> not that hard to study american history. not that long. >> she's had a lot of fun. >> it's not that hard. >> what she will be able to do, as you said when she went to new hampshire, she will attract the media attention. she will attract the crowds. it's why she will be a candidate, media candidate, when she goes in. she has the movie star quality but it doesn't go very far. >> this abc news/"washington post" poll just out found 64% of registered voters overall and 40% of registered republicans said they won vote for palin in 2012. >> the question is whether she will run as opposed to whether she can win. even in that instance depending on what splits are, you know, chris, you made this argument before. sarah palin could get in. michele bachmann will make it harder. i think she will run well.
it was important for sarah palin if she was going to have a path, winning iowa was important. with tea party activists, that will make it harder for her to win the nomination. >> here is palin on sunday talking about bachmann, the very point we are making. let's listen. >> is there room in the race for the two of you or would you split the same base of voters? >> no, we have differences, too. i have many years of executive experience, too, and she has her strengths she will add to the race. but, no, yeah, there's certainly room. the more competition, the better. >> michele bachmann has to win iowa. can she win? >> she can do what huckabee did last time. >> she is what she is. >> she is what she is. >> i disagree with her on a lot of things. she is michele bachmann. i don't know who romney is. >> if sarah palin gets in, can she still win in iowa?
>> i think at the end of the day, it won't be a split vote. people -- they are going to watch -- they will watch and make choices. >> this isn't "morning joe" tag-team, you get to ask questions. you still aren't answering questions. do you think sarah palin is qualified to be president? >> i think she has deficiencies. >> up next, ten years since will tax cuts. conservatives said they would increase revenues. remember that reagan line. cut taxes and will money will come in. it is loaves and fishes. no, it ain't. i love that my daughter's part fish.
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$2.6 trillion added to the national debt according to these groups. would we be better off without the bush tax cuts never been enacted period? >> you mean for middle income as well? >> overall. if we had to choose between no tax cuts at all or what we got, would we be better off? >> we may be better off. certainly the bulk of the tax cuts went to the wealthiest americans and created the biggest gap in income between the very rich everyone else that we've seen since 1928. but you may be right. but certainly -- >> i'm asking you. i don't know. i'll ask you one more time. would we be better off without having passed the bush tax cuts? >> i think the tax cuts for middle income people are appropriate. and that the bulk of the tax cuts should be repealed. >> okay. let me ask you about the future. do you think the president when he gets in negotiations with joe
biden the vice president, is this on the table? is medicare on the table? is everything on the table or not? >> well, john boehner said that no revenues are on the table at all. of course, we know that medicare is on table. both the republicans in the house and the senate overwhelming only four republicans in the house didn't vote for it. this is the way they want to solve the debt and the deficit problem while 81 person of americans say tax millionaires and billionaires. >> what is it? the last time we had this fight, we had a proposal by the democrats to begin to take back the tax cuts for people that make over $250,000 a year. now you're moving it up to a million as the cut line? >> well, actually i support the president's proposal at $250,000, but in addition i'm creating new tax cuts in my fairness and taxation act that start at million dollar earnerers for year. 45% would be their new tax rate
ratcheting up to people who earn in one year and they do, a billion dollars. that would be 49% tax rate that's lore than during the regan years. i'm giving them a bargain and asking them to pay fair their share. >> do you believe the president agrees with you? >> well, i don't know what he thinks is possible. i certainly think that he does agree that the very richest people and he said it in his speech at g.w. last month when he said he believes that rich people actually believe in this country and believe that paying their fair share of taxes is the right thing. i had a millionaire in my conference this morning who says he doesn't think it's moral for him to have his taxes low while seniors are being asked to pay more more medicare. >> you're on the popular side. let me ask you about this sticky business with anthony weiner. should he leave the caucus or the congress? or is this going to go on and on and on? are you comfortable with him
deciding to stay in congress or should he leave? >> you know, anthony wiener is my friend and i think he's a great congressman. i think mansy pelosi asked correctly for an investigation. >> that doesn't prove anything against him, if that doesn't prove he broke any ethics laws is should he tay? >> he says he wants to stay and let the people of his district decide. i think fair enough. i'm not sure if the pressure mounts anymore that that's going to be possible. i understand where he's coming from. >> it's not up to the house? >> well, it is up to the house, i think. >> you said it's up to the voters in his district. which is it? is it up to the house or the vote ners his district, which is snit. >> if he violated rules in the house that's a different matter. if he didn't, i think it's up to the voters of the district. >> okay. i know where you stand. thank you for coming on "hardball." >> thank you. when we return let me finish
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of it. what she wants is bad news about america. what excites her isn't politics the debate of one side against the other. what she wants is bad news about america. what excites her is not the chance to participate or lead in government. she quit government. dumped it, really. she had other interests. no palin is out to cause trouble. she wants people to be mad at politicians, mad at government, mad at the people that report on government. she wants unhappiness with politics and government that dominate the airways that dominate the conversation, dominate the country's mood. she wants us to think about government the way the early colonists thought about the british. she wants us to arm ourselves to fight the red coats. she wants us to live in a state of rebelon. ever tested the people to run the government. the people who cover the people in government. she wants us to believe toward the government the way people look at the government as the enemy. this is why the 2012 election is not who will lead us but if we are